Forum:Icons revamp

Forums: Index > Planning Forum > Icons revamp

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I have been looking at the Icons categories and wondering for a while now if they have expanded/been reused to the point of meriting a revamp. In particular:

• Combining all armor slot icons into a main category. For example, instead of having Category:Tower Shield Icons, Category:Kite Shield Icons, Category:Round Shield Icons and Category:Buckler Icons, one mass Category:Shield Icons should be made. The same thought holds for other slot items such as Chest, Legs, Forearms, etc., since SOE is reusing icons for various "types" - i.e., Image:Leather Chest Icon 02 (Treasured).png is used for both leather and chain armor.
• Splitting Category:Item Icons - which is becoming far too large in my opinion - into more descriptive cats, such as Animal, Vegetable, Mineral, Container, Furniture, etc. Category:Melf's Book Icons is a wonderful example of how perfect a targeted category can be (although I would move his/her icons to a cat that did not contain his/her name).

Janze-Nek 10:38, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Go for it, they've needed it bad. The current state of disarray makes it hard to find the proper icon in a quick and efficient manner when wikifying pages. It's kind of funny -- what you're describing is something I'd wanted to do after the spell icons, but I got so busy that I dropped the project. If you'd like, I can expand Template:Icon to accept Equipment or Item icons (and then whatever parameters you'd like) to categorize them. The icon's you've been uploading look good -- are they from the .dds files, or a good-quality screen capture? --lordebon 11:09, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Agreed. They've needed it bad for a while. I say go for it.--Kodia 12:59, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

lordebon - a template seems a fuss when I can go on as I always do, adding the cat after uploading so a blank Summary section is not created. I will also be able to change the licensing from {{ss}} to {{ss|-}}, allowing the license to show on the file page but limiting the categories the image is listed in to the one(s) I add. If you make a template that does all those things (no Summary, plain license, LOTS of cat switches) I would use it. It really does seem to me like a waste of time to make such a template, though. Janze-Nek 00:04, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Three months later:

• The combination of Equipment Icons has been mostly achieved, with Jewelry icons now under discussion.
• I have started moving Item Icons into smaller cats.

Janze-Nek 18:34, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Icon Naming & Organization

One point that we got to on another forum topic on Icons is duplication of icons due to them being used in multiple places -- both as jewelry and as general items, for example. There are a number of ways to name and organize icons, and I think when it comes to naming we may be best served with a relatively simple, if not highly descriptive, naming scheme. One method for item icons would be to differentiate them in two ways -- by rarity (background color), which we already do and then just by number. This would make the icon names into a format along the lines of "Item Icon 0123 (Legendary).png". The task of sorting the icons so that they can be found relatively easily would then be left up to the categories that Janze has been working very hard on. If an icon is used on a finger slot item, then that icon would be added to Category:Ring Icons so that future users trying to find that ring icon would be able to find it there. --lordebon 19:27, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

I believe an icon should be named by what it looks like - is a flower, is a key, etc.. Considering SOE's habit of reusing icons ( for a head item, for a ring, etc.), us going by what the icon looks like and not what it is used for seems reasonable to me.

For that reason I dislike the generic label of "Item Icon". If it were reserved for ambiguous icons ( and for examples), that would be fine. But to condemn icons sorted into cats by their looks yet still have only the broad title of "Item Icon" is too confusing.

Adding a second cat if an icon is used for a specific slot item does not bother me, although I think it is redundant unless the icon is truly an ambiguous picture and is left under Category:Item Icons by default. A flower is a flower. Janze-Nek 15:24, September 1, 2009 (UTC)

It's really the ones that are ambiguous that bug me. For example, . It could be a ring, it could be a wrist item, heck in theory it could even be a forearms item. How do we keep consistent naming even there? I guess we could call them all Jewelry Icon 123 since so many are reused over all the different slots there. I have no problems with the ones like the flowers or keys where it's pretty clear what the icon is. (Bear in mind I'm mainly talking about jewelry still here)

As for the categories... my thinking there is if you're looking for an icon for equipment, you should check the slot is is first. So if I'm looking for the icon in the previous paragraph for a wrist slot, I should look in Category:Wrist Icons first. If we leave them in only one category (the category they were originally placed in), then I would not find it there, I'd have to look through the others. If we categorize them into whichever slots they are used in though, then it should make it quicker to find it for reuse later, at least that is my thinking. --lordebon 15:42, September 1, 2009 (UTC)

I used the bracelet-as-ring icon to support my argument SOE reusing icons for their own purpose. I voted for Category:Jewelry Icons weeks ago, so let us leave Jewelry Icons in the other forum.

I have already said I do not mind secondary cats being added to a file although I think it is redundant. If you (plural) believe adding a second (or third, etc.) category to an icon is beneficial then so be it. I do not believe an icon should be double cat'd if the icon is obviously NOT of of the slot description - a flower belongs under Plant Icons, a key under Mechanical Icons (cats I have not started since the question of cats came under discussion). If the icon is ambiguous, sure, fine, double cat it. I just cannot get my mind around the idea that editors cannot look at an icon as a picture, separate from its slot - SOE does it all the time. Janze-Nek 16:21, September 1, 2009 (UTC)

I think we have two different ways of looking at it. I see the slot-based categories as mini-galleries (All icons that we know SOE has used in that slot, for when you're trying to find an icon for an item) whereas the naming and primary category could be something different. When you look at the categories, do you look at as mini-galleries, or organizing the icons (or in some other way)? --lordebon 16:34, September 1, 2009 (UTC)

I see slot-based categories as mini-galleries of icons that fit that description. File:Chest Icon 53 (Treasured).jpg is a prime example: it looks like something worn on the chest, yet it is currently linked only to a quest starter. Slot = what it looks like on the body.

Catch-all slot cats - charms and symbols - in my opinion, all of them should have a primary name (Doll, Medallion, Book, Skull) and be cat'd as such. Janze-Nek 16:59, September 1, 2009 (UTC)

Ok, I get what you're saying there so far. When it comes to the basic armor pieces (Head through Boots) I agree there, those almost always look like they belong in that given slot. So you see them as based on what the icon looks like rather than which slots the icon has been used in by SOE. Although it's not the way I look at them, there's nothing wrong with it and it is still plenty intuitive.

The main thing I would like to see is the reduction (ideally elimination) of duplicates and a category structure that makes it relatively easy to find an item icon. The way you've been doing it so far is still fine in my book, I'm willing to concede the idea of 'where-used' categories in place of 'what it looks like' categories for consistency's sake, especially since you are the primary contributor when it comes to getting the icons cleaned up.

With that said, can we try to develop a set of "guidelines" (for lack of a better word) for icon naming and categorization? So far, we have 3 major types of item icons:

• Armor/weapon icons, such as head, chest, etc. These look like the slot they are listed under
• Jewelry icons, which we were talking about in that other topic.
• General item icons, which are everything else

I think the Armor/weapon equipment icons are pretty well nailed down, you've done an excellent job on that. The Jewelry icons we were talking about in that other topic, I can go back to talking about it there or we can just move the discussion over here, I leave that choice to you again. The last one you've started some good work on, but I want to talk about that a little more. Should we try to split them up even more? Looking at Category:Book Icons, I see books and scrolls, which make sense, but there are also some things I didn't expect in there, like cards and envelopes. --lordebon 17:26, September 1, 2009 (UTC)

Updates in 2014

I'm not sure if Janze is still around but I'm going to add a Key category like they suggested. Jado818 (talk) 14:42, February 16, 2014 (UTC)